Spiranthessinensis (Pers.) Ames, Orchidaceae 2: 53 1908. (syn. Aristoteleaspiralis Lour.; Calantheaustralis (R.Br.) Aiton ex Loudon; Epidendrumaristotelea Raeusch. [Illegitimate]; Gyrostachysamoena Blume; Gyrostachysaustralis (R.Br.) Blume; Gyrostachysaustralis var. flexuosa (Sm.) Blume; Gyrostachyscongesta (Lindl.) Kuntze; Gyrostachysnovifuburgensis Kuntze; Gyrostachysstylites (Lindl.) Kuntze; Gyrostachyswightiana Kuntze; Ibidiumspirale (Lour.) Makino; Ibidiumviridiflorum (Makino) Makino; Monustesaustralis (R.Br.) Raf.; Neottiaamoena M.Bieb.; Neottiaaustralis R.Br.; Neottiaaustralis var. chinensis Ker Gawl.; Neottiacrispata Blume; Neottiaflexuosa Sm.; Neottiaparviflora Sm.; Neottiapudica (Lindl.) Sweet; Neottiasinensis Pers.; Ophrysspiralis Georgi [Illegitimate]; Sarcoglottispudica (Lindl.) P.N. Don; Spiranthesamoena (M.Bieb.) Spreng.; Spiranthesaristotelea Merr. [Illegitimate]; Spiranthesaustralis (R.Br.) Lindl. …; Spiranthescongesta Lindl.; Spiranthescrispata (Blume) Zoll. & Moritzi; Spiranthesdensa A.Rich.; Spiranthesflexuosa (Sm.) Lindl.; Spiranthesindica Lindl. ex Steud. [Invalid]; Spirantheslongispicata A.Rich.; Spiranthesneocaledonica Schltr.; Spiranthesnovae-zelandiae Hook.f.; Spiranthespapuana Schltr.; Spiranthesparviflora (Sm.) Lindl.; Spiranthespudica Lindl.; Spiranthessinensis var. amoena (M.Bieb.) H.Hara; Spiranthessinensis var. australis (R.Br.) H.Hara & S.Kitam.; Spiranthessinensis f. autumnus Tsukaya; Spiranthesspiralis (Lour.) Makino [Illegitimate]; Spiranthesstylites Lindl.; Spiranthessuishaensis (Hayata) Hayata; Spiranthessuishanensis (Hayata) Schltr.; Spiranthesviridiflora (Makino) Makino; Spirantheswightiana Lindl. ex Wall. [Invalid]; Spirantheswightiana Lindl.);
.
Chinese Spiranthes, Austral ladies’ tresses;
.
One of our recent studies has shown that Spiranthes sinensis can be both glabrous or hairy.
It is interesting that when my friend did the dna studies, i think he could not find a true spiralis from this side. So pink flowers with or without hairs usualy turned out to be sinensis.
.

Spiranthes from India: I am looking for whatever Spiranthes pics any of the members or their friends have. I would be grateful for your help. Please contribute a full plant pic and a closeup.


Here are mine from Manali shot in 2009. Images may not reach the group being larger in size.


Thanks a lot sir for the images. Yes yours are hairy and hence they should be actually Spiranthes australis and not Spiranthes sinensis. Yours labels are already correct :). But many treat them as synonym which is wrong. Me and … are looking for both, may be we have both in India.



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Spiranthes sinensis from Manali HP:  Sending Spiranthes sinensis (Pers.) Ames (syn: S. australis (R. Br.) Lindley) from Manali, HP

…., one of the very few orchids I know, and that too if it is correct identity.


Yes this is Spiranthes sinensis.


Do you have pics of healthy plant of this.
I want to resolve the mystery of Spiranthes sinensis, Spiranthes australis and Spiranthes hongkongensis.

S. sinensis is not supposed to be pubescent originally. But your plant seems pubescent. S. australis and S. hongkongensis have pubescent to glandular hairs.


I humbly request you to read the quote you have read carefully. It says
“Often densely glandular pubescent rachis——“
Often is not the term for Always.
Also the same paper talks about distinct 3-lobed stigma in Spiranthes hongkongensis. Not sure the often is applicable here or not but all contents are in one line.

It also “assumes” that Spiranthes hongkongensis is result of hybridization between Spiranthes sinensisand S.spiralis. The text uses the word “Probably” . Again it is not confirmed.


It has been written in different sense sir. Often densly pubescent hairs with reference to sinensis which was often present with densely pubescent hairs.

So they made a new species of the one which had hairs.

I have not met Mrs Barretto but happened to have met Dr Sun recently. She is the one who evoked my doubts.


Thanks. I am quoting your two statements from this thread.

Earlier
“S. sinensis is not supposed to be pubescent originally. But your plant seems pubescent.”
Now

“Often densly pubescent hairs with reference to sinensis which was often present with densely pubescent hairs.”
Both are not same quotes. Isn’t it?


There is a reason why I said that. Because,

1. People think that Spiranthes sinensis is often pubescent so they described both glabrous one and the non glabrous one as S. sinensis.
2. But according to the original descriptions only the glabrous one should have been Spiranthes sinensis.

3. On the contrary, Spiranthes australis and Spiranthes hongkongensis are pubescent and sometimes even with glandular hairs. So the plant with hairs from India cant be sinensis.


Quoting the original text

Since it (i.e.Spiranthes honkongensis) was first described, this species has largely been ignored by subsequent authors who have referred it to synonymy of Spiranthes sinensis. However, Hu and Barretto (Chung Chi J. 13(2): 4–6. 1976) identified the often densely glandular pubescent rachis, glandular pubescent floral bracts and sepals, and the broad, distinctly 3-lobed stigma as clear morphological characters that distinguish it from S. sinensis.

“Often densely glandular pubescent rachis” is for S. honkongensisnot for S.sinensis. “Often” is with meaning in this line. I repeat Often is not synonym for Always.


I wish we keep the thread an academic one only. Here is the information I have:

In Flora of British India the species was described under the name Spiranthes australis (R. Br.) Lindl., A species name (rather combination) proposed in 1824, based on Neottia australis R. Br. (1810), a species supposed to have pubescent inflorescence spike (it is also supposed to have pubescent bracts and floral parts partly as I read from other sources).
Spiranthes sinensis (Pers.) Ames, is a name (rather combination) given in 1908, based on Neottia sinensis Pers. (1807), a species described from China and differing in glabrous spikes (and bracts and floral parts).
It has recently been considered by most authors (including Flora of China, Flora of Pakistan, etc.) that these two taxa are synonyms, and as basionym of latter is dated earlier, Spiranthes sinensis is accepted name.

It must be remembered that it is matter of taxonomic judgement (and not a simple issue of names), as the two species were originally described as distinct species (they have distinct types). For those who consider the differences are not enough would treat them under single species S. sinensis. Those who think (like original authors) that differences are sufficient, and are also trying to detect further differences to strengthen their distinct identity, would consider them as two separate species. I think … is just trying to do that, trying to settle the riddle, and he being a world renowned Orchid specialist is both qualified to do that. More so he owes the duty of resolving it for us. Let us appreciate that.


The Spiranthes Connection!!: Just wanted to share.

This, Spiranthes issue was raised by … and his PhD supervisor here at HK and very interestingly, just few days before meeting Prof. Sun and discussing with …, the plant flowered here in our green house. I asked Dr. Stephan Gale (my colleague and author of Wild Orchids of Hong Kong) whats the difference and he said sinensis is glabrous and hongkongensis is hairy. So all these created some big doubts in my head as I knew very well that Indian ones are not glabrous at all. Lets hope to come to some conclusion soon. My preliminary doubts say that S. australis should be accepted name with hongkongensis as one of the synonyms, but Prof. Sun says they all are different.


Is it just the glabrous and hairy characters that differentiate these 2 species or some other characters as well?


the broad, distinctly 3-lobed stigma as clear morphological characters that distinguish it from S. sinensis.”


…, can you please share the closeup you just shared here. Here is the one which we consider hongkongensis.


Here is one of the original drawings of Spiranthes australis.


These three plants are not well studied, hence it may not be a good way of distinguishing the three species.

Right now I have less


evidence to support this comment by the original author!!


A Spiranthes Sinensis from Kalatope… you’re right it is hairy… and as … asked… what are the other differences…


Thanks a lot … sir.

Yes this also looks like Spiranthes australis.


The reference I quoted considers S. sinensis and S.australis as synonyms whereas tries to compare S.sinensis, S.honkongensis and S.sunii.


In support of previous reply I am quoting http://www.theplantlist.org/tpl/record/kew-194521

S.sinensis is mentioned as synonym of S.australis.

May I know you reference considering it as two different species?


I am myself the reference. You can quote, … (pers. comm.).


I think the most appropriate answer is what I wrote in another thread:

In Flora of British India the species was described under the name Spiranthes australis (R. Br.) Lindl., A species name (rather combination) proposed in 1824, based on Neottia australis R. Br. (1810), a species supposed to have pubescent inflorescence spike (it is also supposed to have pubescent bracts and floral parts partly as I read from other sources).
Spiranthes sinensis (Pers.) Ames, is a name (rather combination) given in 1908, based on Neottia sinensis Pers. (1807), a species described from China and differing in glabrous spikes (and bracts and floral parts).
It has recently been considered by most authors (including Flora of China, Flora of Pakistan, etc.) that these two taxa are synonyms, and as basionym of latter is dated earlier, Spiranthes sinensis is accepted name.

It must be remembered that it is matter of taxonomic judgement (and not a simple issue of names), as the two species were originally described as distinct species (they have distinct types). For those who consider the differences are not enough would treat them under single species S. sinensis. Those who think (like original authors) that differences are sufficient, and are also trying to detect further differences to strengthen their distinct identity, would consider them as two separate species. I think … is just trying to do that, trying to settle the riddle, and he being a world renowned Orchid specialist is both qualified to do that. More so he owes the duty of resolving it for us.


What I feel that unless such claims are not published in any standard journal and discussed thoroughly, it may be of less relevance to common workers who believe in standard literature. Hoping that … will publish his claim very soon in any such journal so that it can be quoted as authentic reference.

I request him to present the pictures of all three Spiranthes he is mentioning as evidence so that we can believe in such claims, if he feels it ok.


You cant rely on a name just because it is published.
That ways, all botanical names given to a plant, once or multiple times should be valid.
Fact is you yourself have not seen the plant but claiming based on some references. And I am trying to say that those references have been wrongly written, which is very well possible as you can see a lot of times one plant has got multiple synonyms.
Its your perception whatever you wish to believe. Its my perception why I think they are same.
I told u in the first mail itself that the original plant which is Spiranthes sinensis is not hairy. This claim is well known and you may check the protologue. At the same time I have also shared the original icon of Spiranthes australis which is hairy.
Taxonomy is also a matter of your perception. Many such references quoted by you are wrong whether it belongs to flora of China or Kew checklist or Plant List. The main reason being, they studied the herbarium specimens and not the originals most of the times.

I still say in big words that ALL PLANTS TILL NOW KNOWN FROM INDIA ARE NOT S. sinensis because all are hairy. Prove me wrong if you can. Otherwise there is no point of discussion.


To add more:

… do you know there are around 440 names for the genus Spiranthes
BUT ONLY 37 are accepted.
In other words does it mean that around 403 orchid experts made some mistake in identification.

No, its just that they had a different perception. Similarly you have yours and I have mine.


Orchids have a great medicinal value. I have experienced this. One of my friend and me also have used an ayurvedic formulation “Manipoushtic Churna” and results were wonderful in strengthening whole urinogenital system



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VoF Week: Spiranthes sinensis from the way between Govindhghat and Ghangriya:

Spiranthes sinensis from the way between Govindhghat and Ghangriya

Shot Near Jangal Chatti


Nic pics sir. It is found in white from in our area.


Again coming back to same discussion. This is Spiranthes australis.


Yes, the only orchid that I can identify, S. australis


Is it Spiranthes australis sir, I have also confusion in Spiranthes sinensis, but in some books its referred as Spiranthes sinensis.


Spiranthes sinensis doesn’t have hairs but australis has. I imagine who merged them and why?


Dotn worry sir, I have also not seen this plant in wild till now in India.
In HK I sat on it by mistake :P, then after sometime I realised it was all around my @#$@@ !!!



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VOF Week: Spiranthes australis from Gobind Ghat-Ghanghariya Trek:   This very very lovely plant from Orchidaceae was shot from near Helipad Ghanghariya and from a sloping meadow nearly halfway the trek
from Ghanghariya to Gobind Ghat….this one is so special for me…being among very few orchids I have encountered…



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Gori Valley Tour: Orchid 9 for sharing: This one was shot from near ChokoriSpiranthes sinensis… another of few orchids that I now claim to know…


Nice pics sir, yes this species is Spiranthes sinensis……


Spiranthes sinensis (Pers.) Ames, Orchidaceae 2: 53 (1908).
Synonyms:
Neottia sinensis Pers., Syn. Pl. 2: 511 (1807).
Gyrostachys australis var. sinensis (Pers.) Blume, Fl. Javae Nov. Ser.: 108 (1859).
Spiranthes australis var. sinensis (Pers.) Gagnep. in H.Lecomte, Fl. Indo-Chine 6: 546 (1933).
Ophrys spiralis Georgi, Reise 1: 232 (1775), nom. illeg.
Aristotelea spiralis Lour., Fl. Cochinch.: 522 (1790).
Epidendrum aristotelea Raeusch., Nomencl. Bot., ed. 3: 265 (1797), nom. superfl.
Neottia australis R.Br., Prodr. Fl. Nov. Holl.: 319 (1810).
Neottia flexuosa Sm. in A.Rees, Cycl. 24: n.º 9 (1813).
Neottia parviflora Sm. in A.Rees, Cycl. 24: n.º 10 (1813).
Neottia amoena M.Bieb., Fl. Taur.-Caucas. 3: 606 (1819).
Neottia australis var. chinensis Ker Gawl., Bot. Reg. 7: t. 602 (1821).
Spiranthes pudica Lindl., Coll. Bot.: t. 30 (1821).
Spiranthes australis (R.Br.) Lindl., Bot. Reg. 10: t. 823 (1824).
Spiranthes congesta Lindl., Bot. Reg. 10: t. 823 (1824).
Spiranthes flexuosa (Sm.) Lindl., Bot. Reg. 10: t. 823 (1824).
Spiranthes parviflora (Sm.) Lindl., Bot. Reg. 10: t. 823 (1824).
Neottia crispata Blume, Bijdr.: 406 (1825).
Spiranthes amoena (M.Bieb.) Spreng., Syst. Veg. 3: 708 (1826).
Neottia pudica (Lindl.) Sweet, Hort. Brit.: 383 (1827).
Spiranthes wightiana Lindl. ex Wall., Numer. List: n.º 7378 (1832), nom. nud.
Monustes australis (R.Br.) Raf., Fl. Tellur. 2: 87 (1837).
Spiranthes densa A.Rich., Ann. Sci. Nat., Bot., II, 15: 79 (1841).
Spiranthes indica Lindl. ex Steud., Nomencl. Bot., ed. 2, 2: 625 (1841), nom. inval.
Spiranthes longispicata A.Rich., Ann. Sci. Nat., Bot., II, 15: 78 (1841).
Spiranthes crispata (Blume) Zoll. & Moritzi, Syst. Verz.: 89 (1846).
Calanthe australis (R.Br.) Aiton ex Loudon, Suppl. Hort. Brit. 2: 615 (1850).
Spiranthes novae-zelandiae Hook.f., Fl. Nov.-Zel. 1: 243 (1852).
Spiranthes stylites Lindl., J. Proc. Linn. Soc., Bot. 1: 178 (1857).
Gyrostachys amoena Blume, Coll. Orchid.: 129 (1859).
Gyrostachys australis (R.Br.) Blume, Coll. Orchid.: 128 (1859).
Gyrostachys australis var. flexuosa (Sm.) Blume, Fl. Javae Nov. Ser.: 130 (1859).
Spiranthes australis var. pudica (Lindl.) F.Muell., Fragm. 10: 65 (1877).
Gyrostachys congesta (Lindl.) Kuntze, Revis. Gen. Pl. 2: 664 (1891).
Gyrostachys novifuburgensis Kuntze, Revis. Gen. Pl. 2: 664 (1891).
Gyrostachys stylites (Lindl.) Kuntze, Revis. Gen. Pl. 2: 664 (1891).
Gyrostachys wightiana Kuntze, Revis. Gen. Pl. 2: 663 (1891).
Spiranthes neocaledonica Schltr., Bot. Jahrb. Syst. 39: 51 (1906).
Spiranthes papuana Schltr., Repert. Spec. Nov. Regni Veg. Beih. 1: 46 (1911).
Spiranthes australis var. suishaensis Hayata, Icon. Pl. Formosan. 6: 86 (1916).
Spiranthes aristotelea Merr., Philipp. J. Sci. 15: 230 (1919), nom. superfl.
Spiranthes suishanensis (Hayata) Schltr., Repert. Spec. Nov. Regni Veg. Beih. 4: 161 (1919).
Spiranthes australis var. viridiflora Makino, J. Jap. Bot. 3: 5 (1926).
Spiranthes spiralis (Lour.) Makino, J. Jap. Bot. 3: 25 (1926), nom. illeg.
Spiranthes viridiflora (Makino) Makino, J. Jap. Bot. 4: 10 (1927).
Ibidium spirale (Lour.) Makino, J. Jap. Bot. 6: 37 (1929).
Ibidium viridiflorum (Makino) Makino, J. Jap. Bot. 6: 37 (1929).
Spiranthes sinensis var. amoena (M.Bieb.) H.Hara, J. Jap. Bot. 44: 59 (1969).
Spiranthes sinensis var. australis (R.Br.) H.Hara & S.Kitam., Acta Phytotax. Geobot. 36: 93 (1985).
Spiranthes sinensis f. autumnus Tsukaya, J. Pl. Res. 118: 17 (2005).
Spiranthes sinensis f. gracilis F.Maek. ex Tsukaya, J. Pl. Res. 118: 18 (2005), no type indicated.
Distribution: E. European Russia to SW. Pacific Thanks … for these illustrative pics….

Seeing these, I believe that none of my pics from Gori Valley, Chakrata as well as Valley of Flowers area belong to this species.. as all of them are hairy, butSpiranthes australis appears as one of the synonyms in the given list..


Nice Pics and Information … Yes … S spiralis is in list



This ground orchid was shot from near Chakrata town, Uttrakhand during our recent visit..

please validate the id.. … posted the same plant and was identified as Spiranthes australis


yes I am also agree with S australis. … pls validate


Yes I think this is Spiranthes australis, the pubescent one.


Very good pictures. The spiral nature is nicely seen. Is it the reason for the genus name?



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This beautiful ground orchid was found amongst grasses near Munsiyari.. was identified as Spiranthes sinensis
I was happy with the id until there was similar plant identified asSpiranthes australis (sent in my 13th post)…

Wanted to know if this is Spiranrthes sinensis  ??


I think both synonym…


Yes I believe they r not synonyms. One is hairy and other is glabrous.
This mystery needs to be resolved.



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Spiranthes australis from Valley of Flowers and Chakrata


Yes this should not be sinensis but australis. Lets see who resolves this.



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ORCHIDACEAE FORTNIGHT:: Spiranthes for confirmation from VOF- NS 29 : Attachments (13). 4 posts by 3 authors.

Due to my “Spiranthes Dilemma” I cannot certainly say which species of Spiranthes this is…
was my first observation from Gobindghat-Ghanghariya Trek…
Tentatively identified as Spiranthes australis..

Help required to finally fix the id..


This should be Spiranthes australis as it is hairy.

Wonderful pics.



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ORCHIDACEAE Fortnight: Spiranthes sinensis (?) from Uttarakhand DSR_35 :
This Spiranthes  was shot near Joshimath in Chamoli district (Uttarakhand) at about 2600m altitude on a grassy meadow. It is a copy of my optical photo taken in 2006.
The ID may please be validated or otherwise.

This should be Spiranthes australis.



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Orchidaceae Fortnight: Spiranthes sinensis from Manali GS-27  : Attachments (2). 2 posts by 2 authors.

Spiranthes sinensis photographed from Manali in October, 2009


Hmmm… this should be Spiranthes australis.


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Orchidaceae Fortnight:: Spiranthes sinensis | Chakrata : Attachments (1). 4 posts by 3 authors.

Chakrata, Uttarakhand
Aug., 2013

S australis I think


Yes lets keep the hairy guy as Spiranthes australis.



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Spiranthes spiralis (L.) Chevall. : 11 posts by 3 authors. Attachments (6)

Location:  Deurali, Dolkha, Nepal
Date: 5 September 2017
Elevation : 7700 ft.

One of our recent studies has shown that Spiranthes sinensis can be both glabrous or hairy. Based on that your plant looks like Spiranthes sinensis. But you will be surprised that there is another undescribed species distributed along which is hairy and flower is white in colour but flowers are slightly bigger than this.


Thank you very much.

Interesting part is when I guess S. sinensis it becomes S. spiralis

and S.spiralis becomes S. sinensis.  Anyway it is a good learning
from experts like you.
What about my earlier posts about Spiranthes.

Grateful that I am learning a lot.


It is interesting that when my friend did the dna studies, i think he couldnt find a true spiralis from this side. So pink flowers with or without hairs usualy turned out to be sinensis.


Are all our posts of spiralis in efi site are of sinensis now?


I will have to check one by one 🙁


Thanks, …  May I request to pl. have a look.


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Orchid for ID :: Auli, Uttarakhand :: Aug 2018 :: ARKOCT-32 : 6 posts by 5 authors. Attachments (3)

Saw this lone orchid on the sloping meadows of Auli near the top of the ropeway. It was nearly only 5-6 inches in length.

Please validate if it is Spiranthes sinensis, could not take pics of the leaves.


Spiranthes yes. … may throw some more light on it.

Yes this could be Spiranthes sinensis. Cant confirm without dissecting and the flowering time is very different too.

Spiranthes sinensis(Pers.)Ames  commonly known as the Chinese spiranthes, is a species of orchidoccurring in much of eastern Asia, west to the Himalayas, south and east to New Zealand, and north to Siberia



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Spiranthes sinensis (Pers.) Ames : 7 posts by 3 authors. Attachments (7) – around 600 kb each.
Location: Nagarkot,  Kathmandu
Date: 03 August  2019
Elevation: 1888 m.
Habit : Wild

Spiranthes sinensis was believed to be non-hairy and then it is not the only species of the genus found in Himalaya. But then our study says it comes in both hairy and non-hairy forms for which I am shocked. Of course genetic studies have their own limitations.



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Erebiculum National Park Munnar May’09?; Spiranthes sinensis from Munnar – indiantreepix | Google Groups


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Spiranthes sinensis correct ID : 7 posts by 4 authors. Attachments (1)- 4 mb.

I looked at the site and wondered if this is S. sinensis. I believe it is correct.


From where and when?


Somewhere in Nepal.


This is from Phulchowki Nepal. Growing in a south facing grassy area at 2300m. Photo taken 29 September 2020


It is hard to make out. Spiranthes sinensis comes in both hairy and non hairy forms. Then this is not really the flowering time of S. sinensis. But so far only S. sinensis is known from Nepal.

So I will consider it S. sinensis unless someone dissects the flower and shows the inner parts.


Yes it is S. sinensis….

It has wide range of flowering period from August to November in Elevation above 2000m asl.



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Spiranthes sinensis (Pers.) Ames : 9 posts by 4 authors. Attachments (8) -a round 250 kb each.

Location:  Nagarkot
Date: 21 August 2018
Elevation:6800 ft.
Habit : Wild

what an unique grorowth pattern in a terrestrial orchid. vivid colors


It was flowering in August???? Wow, thats interesting. Cant be sure then if this is sinensis!!


Yes …!  Any suggestion ?

Cant help much without looks at the dissected flower. sinensis can be both hairy or non hairy. But then there are other hairy things too. please find the paper attached and if you can study the flower 🙂 to help yourself!!
Attachments (1)– 066 2017 Spiranthes himalayensis PHYTOKEYS (1).pdf- 3 MB.

Ok …


I have gone through the article but not been able to decide. I guess only S. sinensis and S. spiralis are listed in Nepal.


Yes Spiranthes sinensis.


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