Veronica stewartii

Veronica stewartii Pennell, Acad. Nat. Sci. Philadelphia Monogr. 5: 81 1943. (syn: Cochlidiosperma stewartii (Pennell) D.Y.Hong & S.Nilsson; Veronica hederifolia subsp. stewartii (Pennell) A. G. Elenevskii; Veronica hederoides M. Fischer);
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Pakistan (Swat, Hazara), Jammu & Kashmir (Kashmir), Afghanistan (Laghman) as per Catalogue of Life;
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kalatope id al140311b:
A tiny flower for your perusal..
Location Kalatope, Chamba
Altitude 2100 mt
Habitat: periphery of the fields
Habit: Herb
Season : March
Flower: dia 2 mm

Not being a member of your group, can I mention this item, which I passed by in googling something –
https://groups.google.com/indiantreepix/-7DoRPjCEao
Doesn’t look to me at all like Veronica polita, but rather Veronica hederifolia.
I’d be grateful if you could add this to the thread for clarity, given the comments there.

he might be right. i searched images

Veronica hederifolia 

As per Pennell Scrophulariaceae of Western Himalayas, V. hederifolia does not grow in Himalayas, it has very long pedicels longer than leaves, deeply cordate bracts, he described Himalayan plant as V. stewartii with shorter pedicels, ovate, ciliate with long hairs and leaves usually 3-lobed. I have herbarium specimens which I will upload separately.   

After looking at keys and text supplied by …, and other sources, I agree this Veronica from Kalatope is indeed V. hederifolia. perhaps new for our database.

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Veronica stewartii from Kashmir : 6 posts by 2 authors. Attachments (1) – 762 kb.

Pennell who published revision of Scrophulariaceae of Western Himalayas in 1943, ignored V. agrestis but listed V. didyma, also did not record V. hederaefolia from Himalayas:.

V. didyma (syn V. polita Fries): leaves longer than broad, oval to lanceolate, dentate, corolla pale violet with darker veins in posterior lobe, capsule flattened, notched.,
V. stewartii: leaves broader than long, shallowly 3-lobed, sepals ovate acuminate,pedicels 2-4 mm long much shorter than petioles (10-15 mm long) capsule turgid, rounded or slightly notched at apex. (V. hederaefolia Europaen species with 5-lobed leaves, pedicels much longer than petioles, equalling or longer than subtending leaf),

This is image of Herbarium sheet for comparison.

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For reference I’ve attached a description of V. hederifolia as found in UK flora here, from Sell & Murrell Flora of Great Britain and Ireland vol 3. There are 2 subspecies here in the UK, I’m not sure what subspecies may lie further afield across the continents or indeed similar veronica. Attachments (3)

It will really help if you could forward description (and possibly key separating the three species) of Veronica polita and V. agrestis, both of which also occur in Europe. It may help in sorting our specimens. V. stewartii which Pennell described as new species in 1943, replacing hitherto known Himalayan specimens of V. hederifolia, is quite distinct, as can be seen from herbarium image I uploaded separately today.

I’ve attached descriptions of persica/agrestis/polita from 3 European flora.

Sell3 = Sell & Murrell Flora of Great Britain and Ireland vol 3 (2009)
FBI = Flora of the British Isles ed 3 (Tutin and Clapham) (1989)
FEU = Flora Europaea – slightly older but has a more European embrace.
As you’ll have spotted, Sell3 is the most recent.
I’ve also attached keys from Sell vol 3 and Stace ed 3 (2010). Note that Stace ed 4 has just come out now and probably shouldn’t differ in the key. Stace is what Botanists here use and carry about, as it all fits in 1 portable volume by having good keys supplemented by brief descriptions of further characteristics.
And I’ve attached a visual veronica sheet “veronica-field-speedwells” I made for the Edinburgh facebook botany group using photos from around about, which may assist too but will be just the floristic races that are around me.

Thanks a lot dear …, that should help a lot.

Should I take this as Veronica stewartii ?

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Is it some Veronica species?: 8 images.

Am posting photos of a plant growing on the side of a path in Srinagar. The photos were taken very recently. It is a hairy herb. The flowers are minute about 1-2mm long with pinkish white corolla. Because of their small size  they look like dust specks to the naked eye and can only be examined properly with a magnifying glass. All photos of flowers unless mentioned were taken from specimens put under a dissecting microscope. It has four lobes of very hairy calyx divided to base. The four lobes of corolla (1-1.5mm) are divided to 3/4 of the length. Two stamens with filaments 1mm long bearing minute anthers are adnate to the corolla, The ovary differs from that of Veronicas in being globose. The style ends in a very hairy stigma. Would request the members to suggest the correct ID if this herb.
Photo1 and Photo 2 are the plants (Each small square of graph paper=1mm)
Photo 3 is  a view of the flower
Photo5 shows the two stamens adnate to corolla just as in Veronica persica

Photo 8 is a photo of a mature fruit

Looks different from similar looking species like as per images at
https://efloraofindia.com/2011/04/05/veronica-persica/
https://efloraofindia.com/2011/04/05/veronica-didyma/
To me appears close to images (reported introduced in India) as per images and details
https://efloraofindia.com/2019/03/19/veronica-hederifolia/

Thanks for the suggestion,
I think it cant be V.hederifolia because as … has pointed out in another post the pedicels of hederifolia are long but in this plant they are barely 1-2 mm long. This is apart from the fact that it does not occur in the Himalayas. … in another post  has mentioned another Himalayan plant V.stewartii which has 3 lobed leaves and short pedicels. However there are no details given so as to  ascertain whether it is V.stewartii or not. Information about the shape of the ovary would be very helpful as most veronicas have flattened ovaries but this plant has a globose ovary. Further in this plant all the four lobes of the corolla are almost of equal size.
A local villager told me that villagers call it “Zaw Ghas” literally meaning “Lice grass”. I think this is so called because its tiny pinkish white flowers resemble lice.

According to Wikipedia corolla of V .hederifolia is 1 cm i.e 10 mm wide and blue in color but corolla of this plant is just about 1mm wide and pinkish white.

Some clarifications:

1. The vernacular name is I think best spelled as “Zow ghas” Zow rhyming with “how” and translated as”louse weed”.
2, I had written hairy stigma but actually these are not hairs but elongated papillary cells
3.The capsule has 4 seeds and placentation is axile. I will post the photos in due course.
 
Some more photos:

Photo1 : Capsule with short 2.5 mm pedicel (small square =1mm)
Photo2: Upper wall of capsule removed to show two locules and axile placentation.
Photo 3: 2 seeds removed.
Photo4: All 4 seeds removed and empty capsule.

What about I’d?

For ID with my limited expertise I would like the opinion of the respected experts of this group.
I have tried to post as much detail as possible to help the experts to arrive at the ID. Will post one more photo to show that unlike most veronicas the corolla lobes are almost of equal size only the lowest is perhaps slightly smaller.
Seems at least for this group it is a new addition. Could be a new record for Srinagar.
Hope some expert member will provide more clarity
Your plant is clearly V. stewartii.
See my post, I could get hold of herbarium sheet only, no live images. Good you got live images.

Better images of V. polita here
https://groups.google.com/g/indiantreepix/c/KV

Thanks for the definitive identification

One more photo of V.stewartii flower (Kashmiri name “Zow Ghas” )
Flower seen from front. I have intentionally not cropped the photo so that the actual size of the flower is emphasized

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